School Committee: October 9, 2025

Transcript captured from YouTube auto-captioning. No speaker labels; proper names and dollar figures occasionally misheard. Click any timecode to jump to that moment in the source video.

0:15 [Music] [Music] Okay, looks like we are all set up. I’m going to um I’m going to call the meeting to order at 12:01. Um, I did I don’t know. Well, I I will open it up to public comment in case um if anybody has any public comment. I think it’s really us on the call and and um Oh, wait. Anyway, if anybody has a public comment, please raise your hand. Um and then the second agenda item I had on here was minutes approval. I’m actually going to postpone these. I think we’re not

1:01 technically under OML and so I would rather just get to the meat of the discussion. I may approve all like ask that we approve all the minutes at once at the end of this just so we have a record of everything that we said but I don’t think that it’s as important to be releasing minutes regularly for this ad hoc committee um and and people can follow along on the live streams. Um, so that brings us right into um, Lena, you said you had a presentation. I think that’s a good place to start. » Great. » So I I’ll please take it away. » Sounds good. I just sent the request to share my screen. Henry, » I should have approved that. So hopefully

1:47 hopefully hopefully » Thank you very much. Yep. Okay. Can everyone see my screen? Okay. » Yes. Great. Uh, yes. So, we’ll jump right into it. So, um, thank you to the committee for having us again back. Um, today we have Brian Dacon with Lefield, Molly Paris with RDA, and myself with Lefield. I think I don’t think I miss anybody any of the any of your consultants. But, uh, this schedule should look very familiar. Um, I’m just going to touch upon this quickly. Uh, so we’ve got today, um, the committee meeting and then, um, there will be another, um, committee meeting in November. Um and again this project is intended to um start construction uh next year in 2026 um really focusing with um the um the summer when the students are and staff are out of the school.

2:32 school. school. So I’m bringing up the um schedule for whoops the schedule for um the next two months. Uh so we’re here today um October 9th at your um subcommittee meeting. Our bidding documents are available um to the pre-qualified biders starting on the 15th of this month with a contractor walkthrough that is um not required but encouraged uh on the 21st at 3:00 after the students get out of school and then filed sub bids which include the roofing, plumbing, mechanical and electrical contractors on the 29th of October. And then one week later, the general um prime biders uh their bids are due um from the pre-qualified general contractors. I did

3:19 just want to say that this is um this is a um a tight bidding schedule. So these dates, although it doesn’t say it on here, are subject to change uh based on, you know, especially after the walkth through on the 21st, we um will probably receive requests for information or RFIs from contractors and that agenda may need to be issued. And so um we will notify, you know, the committee through the chair, um and Michael Perling, uh that if we need to push the any of these bidding dates. Um but we still are um planning on um going forward with bidding as um shown on the screen.

4:03 And um next slide is the um construction cost estimates in your uh packet. You should have the full estimates both from um PMNC who is um who is RDA’s um thirdparty consultant and RLB who is Leftfield’s third party consultant. um both third party estimators um who do a lot of public work and as you can see um just jumping right down to the bottom numbers. So our construction control budget within the project is uh just over $11 million and both of the estimates um came in right under that. So um this is this is good news um as we are trending on budget according to the estimates. uh we really as everyone knows really won’t have real numbers

4:48 until the bids come in but this is um good news and um so just to touch upon a note here so ceiling removal and reinstallation we’ve coordinated this with the district we um so Todd has has said that um he would be able to do this with his staff um but if we need to we can help the district procure a third party or I’m sorry not a third party but a ceiling contractor through Um, chapter 30B really it’s removal and reinstallation of the ceilings. Uh, the plan right now is to the day that school gets out the the next day um facility district facilities will clean the classrooms, move the furniture and we will have the ceiling contractor or be working with the district and have them

5:34 ready to go uh that next day after. So even as the general contractor is mobilizing, the ceilings are already being removed and so the general contractor has no excuse because the ceilings will be open. Uh and then the plan is once the um really it’s the mechanical and plumbing contractors that need to get above those ceilings um to do their work. Once that is done um at the end of the summer, this ceiling contractor or the district facilities will come in and reinstall um the ceilings uh there as well. And these are these are drop ceilings. These are grids. These aren’t correct plastered ceilings or anything like that. » Yes, that’s a good clarification. Yep. These are acoustical um ceilings. There are no um hard drywall or plaster ceilings um involved in this work. » Thank you.

6:20 » Absolutely. Uh you’ll notice on here as well um we have the both estimators um did estimates for alternate one which is the roof restoration because that’s how it’s being bid as an alternate. And uh the you know these are estimates so the numbers you know are slightly different but RLB is estimating it’s a savings of approximately 500 a little over $500,000 and PMNC’s estimate shows um it’s a little over a million dollars. So um yeah I’m going to go to the next Yes. Um I believe Kareeimma has a question. » Yeah. Just staying with that estimate. Do you know how much of that estimate has allowances built into it and like where our like dollar value like the um

7:06 the risk is and how much they were actually able to price versus whether they just plugged in allowances with unknowns. » Sure. That’s a good question. So I do um when we went through the estimate reconciliation uh both estimators and their teams um were on so um they were on the estimate reconciliation. I did hear them talk about getting numbers and having conversations specifically, especially with HVAC and roofing contractors. Um, I did not hear specifics about plumbing and electrical, but um, I I think it did provide some good comfort for HVAC and roofing contractors. Um, as far as allowances, Karema, I would say that, um, you know, between design and pricing contingencies and escalation,

7:53 those, you know, would be I’ I’d say like a a um somewhat of a a I don’t know the right language to use. Probably like a Yeah, I’d say they’re not they’re not hard allowances within their um within their numbers, but there’s, you know, some some ability within there to to move. Um, yeah. Does that answer your question? a little bit. I just I I uh I’ll start this meeting, but I didn’t have a chance to go through a lot of the documents. So, I just I’d quickly se seen a couple allowances within the actual budget. I know we have a design contingency at the end. So, but that’s good information that they actually received like they went out to an HBAC sub and the roofing sub for some of the bigger stuff to get um numbers. Um okay. I just but I had seen a bunch of like not a bunch but I saw plugs throughout their estimate which flags risk and I just didn’t know

8:39 I didn’t have a chance to figure out how much it was and where we were risk-wise for it but okay

8:48 » one of the if I could just touch on that too um one of the things was you know that was the estimate was based on the 60% documents so that might be why some of them were plugged in as allowances but during that reconciliation that Lena was talking about um we kind of clarified the scope more closely to 90%. So um okay » it might be shown as kind of allowances but we feel comfortable that the it captured the closer to 100% scope. » Okay, » good point Molly. Thanks. And so the next two slides um h RDA developed these um and we previously went through them in detail. Um we weren’t planning on going through them

9:33 in detail today. We really wanted to um hear from the committee and just um you know really encourage conversation within the committee um about you know these these options about the roof recover um versus roof restoration. Uh, and so that that was really the end um of the presentation, Henry. Um, unless you want us to go through these in detail or if you’d prefer to have committee conversation around it. » Uh, well, it’s it’s a great segue because we I um sort of the next item on here to to talk about those. I I don’t know if you want to leave these up while we have a discussion, but » I did invite um Mike Velgi to this meeting. uh he was I believe he was the Mike you were the one who brought us this option

10:21 and so I thought that or that you would be a good person to speak to some of the the pros and cons here and I think open this up to Q&A and discussion because this is really the biggest uh decision that we have to make on this committee. » Uh so Mike, would you like to introduce yourself? » Sure. Um uh I own Building Enclosure Associates. I’ve been in business for about 40 years. We’ve done lots of roofing projects uh replacement recover as well as the fluid applied restoration on clients such as Mana Fizer. So we have a lot of experience in all types of different types of roofing systems. Um one of the things that I’m just going to

11:08 jump back to the estimate for a second. I was a little bit surprised that there’s a half a million dollar difference between the two cost estimators. If you look at line item um on the alternate the fluid applied the credit from RLB is half a million and the PMC is $1.1 million. And I I’m a little bit surprised at that large difference. Um, and I’m, you know, we got the estimates and everything else yesterday, so I haven’t really had time to study why there’s such a a significant difference uh in those two estimates. But, uh, I just want to point that out that there’s u the $18 a square foot that is carried,

11:55 I believe, by PNMC is is the market price for the coding system. So, I’m not sure why there’s such a Do you know, Lena, why that might be? That’s a good question. Um, Mike, I don’t know specifically um on their numbers why um why they carried what they did for um the roof restoration and the difference um between that. We can look further into that. » Okay. All right. I just want to point that out in case anybody else didn’t pick that up. But anyway, moving forward. Um so, you know, when you come to there’s three real different options. you’ve got a complete roof replacement where you take all the insulation out, you take the membrane out and you start from scratch. Then you have the next level of uh work

12:43 uh and I consider the roof recover and fluid applied um you know pretty much the the same in terms of um you know service life. Both of them will come with a 20-year warranty. um they’re less uh less of a scope of work than full replacement and some there’s a pros and cons to to both and if you go to the next slide you know everything’s over there but I think the major difference between a roof recover and a fluid applied replacement is um is really what you’re getting with a fluid applied system and that is now you’re getting a

13:28 complete monolithic system. There’s no seams. Uh everything is flashed. Uh when you do a roof recover, you still have the same roofing membrane that you had with the roof replacement. So a a restoration fluid applied restoration, you don’t you don’t have any seams to worry about. In addition, uh depending on the manufacturer that is selected, they’ll come out here. they’ll come out to the high school uh every year and inspect the roof and do repairs. One of the problems I think we’re running into in in the town is that, you know, we’re we’re it’s almost like crisis management. Uh if somebody is maintaining the roofs and being diligent about taking care of the roofs

14:14 over the years, you could extend the service life if you know what’s going on. Um they’re using this fluid applied restoration system on the uh rec center right now. They’ve done it on the police station. They’ve done it on the DPW building. So it’s not new. It’s been done in town already on uh three or four buildings. They’ve done it uh they’ve used this system on many many schools in the area in Massachusetts. It’s it’s uh it’s a reliable system. You get 20 years. And the other thing that that is also advantageous is that the manufacturer of the system will actually be on site while the work’s going on. So they own it. They own the system. It’s not there’ll be no fingerpointing that the

15:00 contractor is responsible, the designers responsible. Everything is going to end up at the manufacturer uh level. Um however uh there’s a lot of fluid applied coding systems on the market and I would highly recommend that we go not naming uh you know you could have a basis of design but this should be a performancebased system because the uh there’s there’s so many variations in the fluid applied systems that you could use and we don’t want to allow a lower tier or a inferior product to be installed. called on this on the on the high school project. So it’s very important to have a performance-based system and and uh you

15:47 know if you’re going to allow or equal it has to meet the performance requirements in terms of thickness, tensile strength, compressive strength. Uh there’s a whole bunch of criteria uh that we’d be happy to help provide that that uh will ensure that you know the system that you’re actually putting on uh gives you the 20 year uh service life that that uh is expected here. U if the the cost is only $500,000 then I would lean towards a recover option. If the cost savings is over a million dollars, then it’s well worth considering the fluid applied and and save the million dollars in costs. And I’m open to uh any questions uh if

16:35 anybody has any questions or comments. » I just want to jump in really quick. This is Brian Den from Left Field and um first off say we’ve we have worked with uh Mike and Mike’s firm BEA for years. I always say they’re they’re probably first on my list of phone of friends. If we have a question about a, you know, building facade, a roof, I very much appreciate the input, Mike. And when we do get past bidding into submitts and looking at potential equals, we would love to involve you in that process just to make sure that um as an extra set of eyes that um if some equal product is proposed um we’d like your assistance with uh making sure it is in fact an equal product. » Happy to help. I just want to sort of um

17:20 make sure that we don’t end up in a situation that we’re fighting a manufacturer and it becomes a legal issue. So, uh and and there are ways to to do that to make sure that the spec is tight in terms of what the expectation is so that we don’t let anybody with a can of paint out there saying, “Hey, I’m equal. I’m going to, you know, I’m going to put it down on your roof and give you a 20.” I want we want financial stability from the manufacturer. We want a you know superior product uh and and not just you know somebody who’s going to sell us a product that uh they think is going to work for us. » And just to clarify what we’re we’ve um been up to that we totally agree and we

18:06 are putting a performance specification together. basically um the we’re not listing any manufacturers. is purely performance and it’s based on working directly with TMCO and directly with Garland um those representatives that I know you know um Mike and so they’re you know literally reviewing our documents because they’re they’re technically like um Garland’s a polyurea tose polyurethane so we’re we’re making it sort an either or like a polyora can be provided or a polyurethane system but they have to meet those performance criteria and we’re vetting that uh currently to make sure you know in the final hours here that we’re getting it right um with those two manufacturers.

18:52 Um and that being said like if you you know we could if whether or not we have time to do it before bidding it’s something that’s um easily uh adjusted via addendum if we wanted to add even more stringent requirements. But just to be clear that we are working the basis of our spec is directly with TMCO and Garland and it’s a performance spec. » Well, that’s good to hear. I’d be happy to take a look at your spec before it goes out on the street to give you my input. Um, so let me know if that’s uh if you want me to help out there. » Thanks. » So I just two things that I like to add on top of Mike’s comments. Um, the first thing is when we were designing this, I did get a spam email, unsolicited email

19:38 I should call it, and it was for another roofing recover restoration product, and I forwarded on to Leftfield and RDA, and they researched it and identified that they were not in the same quality of what TMCco and or TMCO and Garland are. So, uh, to Mike’s point, there are other products out there that we want to stay away from. Um, so I appreciate that. Um the other the other comment or the other thought I had and I’m not a roofing expert by any means. Uh I’m only told is what I what I’m told. I only know what I’m told. But the majority of my 13 years in school of B business and facilities. When a when a roof leak happens, it typically is around a a seam. Seam is pulled apart. Seam has failed. Um something went on with the seam. And that’s why

20:24 I I kind of like the idea that we’re looking at another option that may eliminate roof leaks in our classrooms because of seams pulling apart and whatnot. So, uh I’m glad that Mike brought this to us and I’m glad that RDA and left field explored this as an option for us and and again, you know, if the prices are equal, you know, I’m with it. Let’s go with the recover. But if there’s a savings and we can possibly reduce the number of roof leaks, um that’s great. My only other thought, and I don’t know if anybody knows this, but the Mass School Building Authority will assist funding in roof projects um after a roof is 25 to 30 years old. I know if we had gone with option A, which isn’t even on the screen, which is a full strip and recover, um that would reset the clock. I don’t know if either option B or C allows us to not reset that

21:12 clock. Meaning in 20 25 years from now, would we be eligible if we needed a new roof at that time for MSBA to come in and assist us from a funding standpoint to do a new roof? » Does that does that my question make sense? » Yes, » I think it does. Let me sort of just rephrase it, Mike, or say it in a way that makes sure I understand it. If we were to proceed with one of these two options on the screen and at some point you’re outside of the window MSBA would consider you. Would MSBA consider a project to redo this project 25 years down the line? Is that » Yeah, that’s » I know no reason to think that they wouldn’t » that they wouldn’t say no, your roof was done in 2026 and therefore you’re not eligible. Would they go back to the

21:59 original date of of 2021 or 2022 when the roof was originally put on and say, “No, your clock started from 20 I’m sorry, 2001, 2002. Your clock started in 2001 and you’re now 45, 50, 60 years into it. So, you’re you’re eligible for consideration. » I think that the clock would reset in 2026 » regardless of what process.” » But that that’s a very good specific question that we can try to get you a definitive answer on. I think one thing to consider is that the MSBA just started like this round of ARP projects started accepting the coding option um as a viable option. And so they might not have that worked out yet, you know, in their 20-year outlook, but it would be I agree with Brian, it would be hard

22:46 to imagine that they would consider this on a 25 year um clock as opposed to the 20 So that’s also good news to hear that MSBA is now considering this as a viable option that it’s not, you know, a unheard of, unconsidered, you know, I’m sure they’ve done their research and they’ve they’ve considered that this is a viable option and not just a uh a cheap alternative to patch a roof, » right? But I think in the public sphere, um, it we’re just a little slower to adopt new technologies, you know, public funding. But to Mike’s point, it’s not new anymore and they recognize the benefits of um, the systems when they are specified correctly and are the right quality. » Great.

23:33 » But it doesn’t have like 20 years of use, you know, um, of project examples to go look at. Gotcha. » All right. Well, thank you for my two minutes. Uh Mark, you have your hand raised. » Awesome. Thank you. Um so I just want to say that conceptually I’m totally interested in the idea of the uh the overlay. Uh probably polyurea would be best, but I’m open to all opportunities there. Um, the one thing that I’m really interested in seeing is when the actual bid numbers come in, if I would expect the delta in pricing between a complete recover and an overlay to be greater than what was represented in the um in the preliminary estimates. So, I’ll be I think picking up this conversation once

24:21 we actually have some hard numbers will will be a little bit more valuable. But but as far as you know a viable method that is tried and true and tested uh I I have no issue with the overlay product. » Thanks Mark. That’s a great point is that it sounds to me again as as not an expert but it sounds to me like [Music] most of the decisions we need to make are going to be informed by the product that is being bid and by um by the savings that we’re were being offered by that. And Mike, I’m glad you » sort of put in a number there that you think makes sense to you. Um, so I mean I I would love to invite um

25:08 Mike back to our next meeting once we’re actually looking at those. » If I can make one more suggestion on on this is more to uh to the OPM lift field is when you guys are bidding, could you consider a separate line item for the polyurea from Garland and the polyin from TMCO? uh as separate line item uh deducts. » Okay. » So if if there were a manufacturer with multiple product level systems, have them provide the pricing for both of them. Is that sort of what you’re getting at? » Yes. What I’m thinking is I’d like to see the difference because there is a quite a big difference in cost between

25:56 the polyurea and polyurethane. So you know if it’s a performance spec let it show up in the pricing. So if you if you had had an add alternate D dot for the polyurea and don’t name manufacturers just say polyurea alt d dot polyurethane alt d dot. Uh I think that would be very helpful in the evaluation process. » I agree completely. That’s that’s a great idea. Yeah, I think I I think it’s a a great idea. We’re just going to have to think about how we structure it in terms of from the context of having to accept alternates in a certain order. Mike, I think you’ve probably known that, but yeah, there’s just a little strategy on maybe Molly, we’ll have to regroup on

26:42 how exactly we do that. And and is there a way that you could also indicate that it’ll be the owner’s discretion on what system they install regardless of price? Meaning that I don’t » there’s limitations to that in the bidding law, but we can, you know, we’re bound by the spec and the or equals laws in Massachusetts. So, um, it is going to be a little tricky to try to get pricing for two different specific name brand systems before you enter into contract and do a submitt, but I don’t want I also don’t want to like close the door on that. Um because certainly we have to think it through, » but it it’s just the nature of the way these

27:28 projects have to be bid is like that we don’t we’re not privy to what product there bid is based on until we get to the submittal phase » and you’re not allowed to ask or negotiate that before you enter into contract. » My my concern is that I really don’t consider uh polyurea and polyurethane equals. So I am on on Mark’s team that my preference is polyurea. That’s a more superior product than the uh urethane product » by by all measures. I mean there’s no question. » Yes, I agree with you Mark 100%. So if there’s any way that we can just eliminate the the polyurethane, that would be my preference and my recommendation. » That would be a a more straightforward

28:13 method from a bidding perspective. For sure. » That’s what I was going to suggest. Molly, as you’re honing in that performance spec, hone it in around the polyurea product. » Okay. » Yeah, maybe that’s where our attention goes because I was just thinking the same thing. I’m not even I don’t think we could get away with even asking for a bid with an identification of the carried system. I I think we have to let that happen after. But it’s a point very well taken, Mike, and I think we can put some strategy behind how the performance spec is written. Let me um ask you Mike, you have found that there are at least three good in your mind equal to gar uh garland manufacturers of the polyora. » Well, we’ve typically used uh polyurea

28:59 garland system on on several large projects with very good success. We’ve also used TMCO uh on different projects, but my research and recent experience um my preference is the polyurea that the Garland makes. » We just have to make sure that it’s a that that two other manufacturers make it or we have to produce a proprietary spec and go through the channels to make that argument with the AG. That’s the concern. And so we we can do that research certainly. Um the idea was that we know that TMCO sorry Karema I see I see you have your hand up. Um that we wanted we know that TMCO’s even I 100% understand and agree on the

29:45 polyurethane but we know that TMCO by nature is is a um » manufacturer that we would have faith in. Um, I just want to make sure we’re not inadvertently creating a proprietary specification by specifying polyorhea and then having Garland be the only one that anyone would ever trust on it. » Uh, I believe there are others. Uh, » I just I just Googled it. There’s several. » We can work with um um Rob, is that the the Garland rep as well? » Yeah, Rob. Yes. » Yeah. Yep. Um and I’m sure when I was working with him on on coming up with some options for this school, he offered his help. I I know. » Oh, yeah. He’s very helpful. We’ve been working kind of handinhand with him. So,

30:30 » so, so and he’s done a lot of schools. So, we’ve I think he’s been over this issue before. So, he’ll be able to give you some feedback and some some insight that he’s had on previous projects. So, » interestingly, I’m sorry I don’t I know everyone has their time is valuable, but um he actually said that at one point way back he said that a lot of times if they are going head-to-head with TMCO as um equals on a public bid that TMCO ends up pointing out like 75% of the time and thought it was interesting. It requires some digging into why is that a price? you know, just that the urethane is polyurethane is just not » um you know, the price speaks for your

31:15 opinions kind of thing. And then right or is it more of just a familiarity with polyurethane? I don’t know. » My understanding is that polyurea is a more expensive product, but because it’s a superior product. So, um but anyway, » the cost benefit is there. Right. Exactly. Okay. » Great. This is really helpful. Thank you. Uh, can I ask a question that’s that’s slightly different because I missed the first meeting. I just want to see if this was discussed. If it was, I’ll I’ll uh catch up with you, Henry, later, but if not, I just got a question about the HVAC systems. » Go ahead. Although, uh, Mark, can I call on Kareema first? She’s had her hand up. » I’m so sorry. Yeah, I can’t see from my phone. » Yeah, that’s all right. It’s Yeah, » apologize.

32:01 » apologize. » apologize. » I’ll come back to you. Uh yeah, just yeah, just to stay with the roofing for a couple seconds. Um and Molly, maybe you can and maybe Mike walk me through just really high level. Um so with the it seemed like a lot of the issues that came from the the leaks were around I know people were talking about seams and like penetrations and obviously we’re going to have a lot of new pipe work. I I saw a lot of details for that so we can kind of make sure that it’s kind of done properly in the field. Does the recover or know the restore option, how does that deal with penetrations and seen or like where we’re actually seeing all of these leaks that happened the first time? And then when I looked at the drawings really briefly, it looked like we were doing just a lot of like putting

32:48 covers down in areas like like pieces of I don’t know what the material was just sort of putting it on top of areas. And I guess what our plan is to like repair the roof rather than just cover. I apologize if this is like a silly question. I just it got a little confused looking at the drawing 20 minutes before this meeting, but » I can speak to that. And also, you know, we we’ve progressed the drawings a lot in the last week as well. Um but the idea is that even for the coding system, all of the HVAC curbs are being replaced because all of the HVAC um equipment is being replaced and they all they are all getting new curbs. So that actually will those will be reflashed and essentially then they’re

33:35 just they’re going to be putting um » you know a membrane a PVC membrane on them and then coating that. So um » okay » so that helps with as far as concern of penetration terminations um above the coating limitation essentially. » Um most regular pipe penetrations will stay in place but of course if the if we find that they’re damaged and can’t accept the coating or you know that the part of the coding prep is to repair those um sealants and terminations. Mike Belgi, you can correct me if I’m wrong. Um, and and then the the preparations that you saw, there’s like different categories of substrate

34:20 repair. So, that gets into different areas where the insulation below the existing membrane to be coated is not it’s either not stable. It’s like buckling, billowing, bowing, or wet. So those areas where we have to go in, cut that wet insulation out, put a new membrane down, and then um and then coat the new membrane as part of that coating system. » And then everything gets it on. » Yeah. Right. So there’s specific areas that are getting repaired then. Yeah. in order to create a an acceptable substrate system because even with the coating that we still need to meet minimum you know code criteria like we can’t have wet insulation. So, um that

35:07 that’s what those are. And it is there are a few larger areas on this roof of that, but that’s part of the cost analysis. Um is that we still haven’t gotten to, you know, 30% of the roofing area, which is kind of this threshold percentage of replacing insulation where then it comes not um as beneficial for the savings. So, we’re still under that. And then just for your knowledge, we’ve we’ve also carried we’ve shown those as specific reference areas, but really it’s a blanket um uh 11,000 square ft of insulation replacement that then we can get a credit for if they don’t use it. » Does that help? » All right, perfect. It does. Yeah. Thank you. » Uh Mark, do you want to come back to

35:54 your question about HBC? » Yeah. Yes. Thank you. And I’ll try to uh consolidate it. Um, have we 100% decided that all of the HVAC is being replaced? » Yes. » Okay. Um, that said, uh, as a potential cost savings, rather than replacing all of the curbs with, you know, new curbs and new PVC membranes, um, could we not just use, um, adapters to make the new rooftop units fit into the existing curbs and then recoat those? That’s question number one. Question number two, because I didn’t see it and I could have missed it. Do we have any sort of pres provision in the initial estimates for mold treatment when the wet foam panels are removed?

36:46 » We do not have any contingency for mold treatment when they’re removed. » Okay, that that is a likely scenario I would say that that we might want to consider.

37:01 And then as far as the HVAC goes, is there a reason we’re constructing new curbs? And if we do go with the overlay method, uh my goal would be to create uh fewer penetrations uh rather than more. So why not just use an adapter to to fit the new rooftop equipment into the existing uh curbs? Those are good questions, valid questions. Um, we’d have to, you know, I’m not, we don’t have the engineers on our call right now, so we’d have to look into that. » Okay. I just see » I can jump in on the curbs real quick, just to offer something. » Sure. » A curb adapter would be roughly the same cost as a new curb for the unit. Anyway,

37:47 if there’s if you’re talking about savings on the roofing side, that’s that’s out of my scope. That’s possible. But, um, if you’re going to buy a new curve for the unit or a curb adapter, it’s going to be about the same cost regardless, » right? Yeah, I was specifically mentioning about about the roofing, but I don’t I don’t know I don’t have any idea what that savings would be, so it might be moot. I just wanted to bring it up as a potential. » Yep. » Cool. » Thank you. And part of the again I’m not the engineer so I don’t want to speak for them but part of the intent is that you know the HVAC is new and it’s going to be there for a long time. So putting them on new new freshly insulated curbs that are dry and we know that they’re in good condition going in. » Okay. Yeah, that’s that’s valid. Thank you,

38:34 you, you, » Mike. Just a really quick point of clarification, uh, with the HVAC replacement, um, the entire building is not currently designed for HVAC. And if it wasn’t designed originally, it won’t have HVAC. It won’t have the AC portion with this new construction or this new. So, we’re not making the entire building HVAC. I just want, if anybody’s listening from home, they Oh, great. The whole building’s going to be AC. That’s it wasn’t designed that way originally. in this plan is not to provide HVAC to areas that were not originally designed for it. That was my point of clarification for anybody listening at home. » Yeah, thanks Mike. That helps. Uh, Lena. » Yep. I just wanted to touch up on um Mark’s question about mold um mitigation

39:20 and just state that although u that was not included in the estimate or the contractor’s contract uh within the total project budget for the project there is a line item outside of the contractor’s contract that is the um owner’s construction contingency which is outside of the contractor’s contract. So if there were things like molds that came up for unforeseen happened on pro happen on projects um and so that would that would be a potential area that we could um you know pay for a change order from. So I just wanted to touch upon that. » Thank you. I think the other point of clarification for the decision on whether we go one one product or not um I think this committee is making a recommendation to the folk school committee and they will ultimately make the decision if I’m if

40:05 I’m right right Henry » yes that’s that’s technically going to be the the process although I you I have no indication from anyone that they wouldn’t be going with recommendation I think Yeah, » I agree totally. I just want to make sure that it’s it’s not, you know, this is a recommendation uh from people who have spent the time to research the products, to research the pricing, to research the bids uh that the full school committee doesn’t have the time or uh expertise to do. » Correct. And then and then of course it does go to the select board as well. So » uh yeah, but I don’t think they have a I think they they vote » no they they yes or no our decision. Yeah. » Yeah. So, I’d just like to and and perhaps this is behind the scene

40:51 planned. I’d like to put meetings for those dates on that calendar. Um because part part of getting equipment released and sort of respecting the schedule get that gets towards next summer is going to be that we try to consolidate that series of approvals as quickly as we can upon receipt of the bids. » Uh thanks Brent. That’s a great point because the the sort of final thing I wanted to bring up was our meeting schedule. Uh if we could sort of set some expectations, particularly knowing we’re going to have bid documents coming in soon. Um you’re right. We if if we have an opportunity to move, I would like to have that that meeting scheduled and ready so that, you know, we do need to we don’t need to, but we should be posting 48 hours notice so that the

41:37 public can join. Um, and so I don’t I don’t want that delay to be built into our project timeline. It doesn’t make sense to me. So, um, » Henry, am I am I right that the school committee’s meetings in November would be the 6th and the 20th? » I think you’re right about that. Uh, third, » the first usually the 1st and third. That’s what I’m going off of. I don’t have the the calendar in front of me. » Yeah, usually. Yeah. So, usually it is the first and third. I can get that I can get the school committee meeting um schedule out to everyone on this call or you know when we’re » I’m just thinking that we’re probably going to want to have this on the November 6th meeting because then we need to get the select board

42:25 right after that and when are the bids back in or the GC bids back in? » Yeah, » that calendar back up. » Sure. Yes, absolutely. And Mike, I will point out that if if we need to ask the full school committee to meet for a one agenda item meeting, I’m happy to schedule that whenever. And I think I think any anybody else on the school committee would agree. So » I think the two Yeah. Right. So GDC’s back on the 5th. » Yes. Yep. » Okay. So if they come back on the 5th, we would have to have a subcommittee meeting on the 6th to go to school committee on the night of the 6th or schedule another school committee meeting for maybe the the 10th or 11th or something. » Yep. Let’s let’s plan for the for the night of the 6th, right? Like move quickly. And I I’ll um

43:12 I I will be sure to schedule something early on Thursday the 6th for this group. » So Lena and and Molly and Brian, if we get them in on the 5th, is it probably 10 a.m. or noon time or something? » No. Yeah, it’s noon. Yep. » Okay. What is our I mean, can we turn that around? » Absolutely. Absolutely. um we can go into a bubble and just be sure that so these are all pre-qualified biders. Uh the bids are coming in via bid dock. So there are no hard copies of bids. Uh the review is really the mandatory requirements and ensuring that um contractors did not receive large projects that would put them over their um capacity to complete. So that can absolutely be done. This is a priority. And so yes, we would be ready for a meeting on the 6th.

43:57 Can can I just ask is it realistic that we will actually have bids two weeks after the bidding documents are available that are that are workable um so that we could make that meeting on the 6th or should we back it up to the next meeting to give them uh some opportunity to ask questions and and actually put together something comprehensive? At least our initial thought on that, Mark, was that um for now we would like to hold this schedule understanding that on the 15th of this month and you know through probably the 24th if we do get a lot of questions or questions that cause us as a team to sort of step back and say, you know what, we need to clarify this. I think we’d we’d prefer to push

44:44 it back on the fly. I know that means we’d have might have to plan some of these meetings in November to to be able to push back, but we would we think with minimal questions, people shouldn’t have a problem with a two-e turnaround. Um, and the questions at this point that might cause us to push it back aren’t stuff we can foresee. We we think we’re in good shape to achieve this two week minimal window for bidding. But I understand where you’re coming from. » Yeah. I mean my my I recently did a uh » a um like a major proposal or I was a part of it for for another institutional building locally uh for a heating system and it took us 3 weeks just to get the

45:32 manufacturer of the equipment to uh to give us pricing on exactly what was specified. » Yep. That’s the type of thing if if we start hearing on the 16th and 17th that um listen guys, with your bid schedule, I’m not even going to be able to get a real quote um out of a manufacturer, that is the kind of thing that we would make the command decision uh probably by the 22nd to say, let’s put out an agenda and push this all back a week. » Okay, fair enough. Thank you. » And I just want to be clear that these are Oh, sorry. I just want to be clear that these drawings are hitting the street next Wednesday. That’s when they’re being published or the the bidding documents. » Yep. » Do you get like though I mean I agree with what Mark is saying because two weeks that’s a really really short

46:17 amount of time regardless of the quality of the the drawings, but do you find out right away if they’re going do they accept right away whether or not they’re going to bid? Do we have feedback on who’s going to bid? because I my other concern is if you might lose biders because they don’t have time to get it turned around in two weeks and they just pass. Um but do you find that will they kind of check the yes or no? Yes. Yes, I accept this RFP. We we’re planning on bidding type of uh process. » I can provide insight on that. Um that’s a good question, Karema. So um I’ve personally worked with a lot of these um pre-qualified uh contractors and so you know and and I’m sure Molly and Brian and others have as well. And so, um, there have been times when, you know, I’ll receive a direct phone call. My

47:02 email is listed in the, um, bidding documents as all questions need to go to me. But if it’s if it’s a major thing, I’ll usually receive a phone call from someone and they’ll just say, “Your bidding schedule’s not, you know, if if what someone was to say, your bidding schedule is not realistic, you know, that’s when we really would start to take a look at that.” I think, um, they’ve all all of the pre-qualified biders were notified that the bidding documents are coming out this month. » Um, yeah. So, and and um the good thing is, and I’m sure you know this and others on this as well, um that this is a good time to um hit the street for bids. And so, um yeah, I expect Kareema that they would reach out um directly to one of us if if this was a major issue and if they weren’t able to um if they weren’t able to uh meet the bidding

47:47 schedule. Um I’m sure I’ll receive I would receive emails as well, but um I would expect phone calls if if that was a major issue. » Yep. We we can put out some feelers. And one of the benefits of using bid docs is like we’ve had some bids recently on a separate project where after two or three days there were no plan holders. You can tell when someone’s a plan holder on on bid docs online and that caused me to make some phone calls um and within a day or so there were a bunch of plan holders. But like so we’ll be able to sort of put out some feelers for that and uh and get some instant feedback. Again, if what we’re hearing on the 16th, 17th into the walkth through is this is not enough time, then we will pretty quickly most I think the 22nd of October is the sort of decision point of do we push it back then? Do we

48:34 push everything back to bids due the 5th and the 12th or the 12th and the 19th? But there’s a little bit of a dance in how much time to give there. understanding where we started this discussion of right now on this calendar we receive bids on the 5th and by the 14th we need all the committee approvals that we need to award it. So what I want to try to avoid is a little more weeks on the front end and more weeks on the back end that push that award date back because both of those will eat out of lead times for the for the equipment. So, completely understand, but we’d like to sort of um play it on the fly between the 15th and call it the 22nd and decide if we need to push back. And on the other side, have the meetings lined up if pretending the fifth is going to work

49:20 until we’re another week or two into this. » Uh I have one comment. I just looked at the roofing drawings and uh when did they do a second IR scan » on the roof? » Yes. My recommendation is whenever we’ve done these type of work is to um indicate the areas where we found wet insulation because otherwise the contractor is going to go you know gang busters to do the work. » We do have those identified on uh and then and then in the last week we’ve cross-cheed them against the new IR scan. » Okay. It should be on sheet. Uh I don’t know the number off the top of my head, but it’s the existing conditions. Um demolition plan is what it might be

50:05 labeled on your end, but it might be um when we’ve updated it to like substrate repair plan. So those areas are shown on the existing, but not in the new plan. » A101 probably. » A 101. Okay, I see. Okay. Um and then do we have results of the test cuts somewhere on the drawings? » So because you know there’s tapered insulation, right? So, do we need to show that the thicknesses of the insulation? Do we have uh test cut locations? » We don’t. I think we’d have to talk about that offline. » Okay, if that’s okay. » Um, yeah. No, absolutely. I, you know, what I’ll try and do is try and review that and get you some comments back on the drawings in the next 48 hours so that, you know, just just to give you some feedback.

50:58 Okay, good. Well, um Brian, sort of in the spirit of keeping um our timelines on I am going to say that we’re tentatively scheduled to meet on November 6th as this group and then report I’ll report later that evening to the um to the school committee for a decision. I think if we have to adjust things, let’s still consider that 14th to be sort of the drop dead date and see how much scrambling we can do on these committees to make a decision. Um, Mike Velgy, I will invite you to that meeting on the 6th because I think it’s going to be valuable to have your input on those documents. Um, and uh, if anybody needs to contact anyone, I have contact

51:44 information. And if anybody has any questions, uh, please reach out. But I think barring any any major issues or timeline shifts, we’ll we’ll be back here on the 6th to make a decision. » And I think on the 13th of this month, next Oh, is that Monday or Tuesday? Um, we’re going to have the full bid docs that I can share out with everybody. Is that is that an accurate or semi-accurate? Bid docs needs them by the 13th. So, we should have them by that date, right?

52:16 I I guess. Well, no, we will be working we’ll be working up until Tuesday afternoon. » Oh, okay. I talked to Lena yesterday and she thought bid docs needed them a couple days in advance. » We’re planning to upload the we’re doing like um as far as we get tomorrow or or Monday, but really we we’d prefer tomorrow for an initial upload to Bidocs and that’s for their review. But those won’t be we’ll still be finalizing things until we absolutely have to upload them. » So if when when I get them out to the committee, I guess my point was when we get them out to the committee, um if there’s questions on them, we need to issue an addendum that will all be done through through you guys. We we’ll communicate with you guys if we consider that there might need to be an addendum or something. I think Lena and I talked yesterday and that was kind of the plan.

53:03 » Yes, absolutely, Mike. And I’m sorry for miss um speaking on the um drawings for the 13th um Mike and Molly, but yes, absolutely. Uh addendum would be handled through us and RDA. » Thank you. » Okay. Well, if there’s is there anything else that anybody would like to bring up before I close out this meeting? » Um could I just follow up on one thing? Uh we had a very good discussion about um the bid specification for the roofing alternate and that’s going to be a very important consideration as was pointed out uh in the meeting uh the public sector is sometimes slow to adopt these new technologies. It’s not because the public sector is uninformed or

53:48 uneducated. Uh a lot of it has to do with the challenge that the public sector has in accepting new technology. um if we were a private owner, we would specify the coding that we wanted and we would instruct the um the the roofing subcontractors to bid that product. Uh that of course in public bidding laws in Massachusetts is illegal and we have to be mindful that we’re going to have to structure a specification that gets us more or less precisely exactly what we want. And everyone has to understand that at the day of bid when we open the documents we won’t know for certainty that we got exactly what we want. So I think that we should spend some time reflecting on our competence in being able to produce a bid document that is going to get us the product that we

54:34 desire. And if we say that, okay, we’re going to specify the material is going to be um is it polyurea as opposed to polyurethane and we’re confident that there’s a an array of biders that are going to satisfy our performance specification, then that’s good. Um, but you just need to kind of be mindful of the fact I’m just curious. I mean, uh, Mike, you’ve obviously done this in other places, so other other public biders have successfully bid this product and they’ve gotten exactly what they wanted. I mean, it’s one thing to be a private owner and say, “Okay, give me a Garland um liquid applied roofing cover.” That’s that’s great. That’s easy. U but it’s harder in the public sector. So, we just need to be confident that we’re uh we’re procuring this thing in a way that we’re going to be confident that the result we get is

55:20 going to be what we want because like a month later when we get the submitt from the roofing subcontractor and we’re surprised it’s not what we want, we’re going to be in a pickle. Thank you, Ralph. » Yeah, thanks, Ralph. I don’t know if anybody has a response to that. Yeah. C can we just um identify what system we find to be ideal and then uh even if we consult with some people in the next couple days here and then put in the composition of the product as in you know polyurea the uh mill thickness that we view as being the ideal uh the ideal coating thickness and put all and the application method if that comes into

56:07 into play and put all of that in the bid document so that there’s no room for error. » Can I respond to that? The answer is yes, as long as you do not go to the point of making it a proprietary specification. » Now, I do think there are several manufacturers of of these polyurea coatings. So, I I you know, and also you can apply many of these in different thicknesses depending on how how heavy you want to go. So we could decide what we think is ideal and I think Mike has the experience to help with that and then we might be able to just put that into the into the bid spec and see where we land. » I think that’s a great idea. Just one just general observation. If there are other products besides the the one that was mentioned, Garland, if Mike Velg is

56:53 confident, oh yeah, there are three or four manufacturers and as long as they met the general specification, their product would be fine and their warranty would be fine and the company would be fine. Then great. But if you’re saying, well, you know, I heard some people make this thing, but the only one I’ve ever seen used is Garland, and that’s the one we want to go with, but we don’t get that. Uh, you know, again, you have to be careful that it’s not a proprietary specification. Uh, and you have a lot of flexibility in trying to tailor the spec to meet what you want. But I just want to be confident that everyone says, “Yeah, there’s three companies out there and if we got a product and it’s not Garland, we’re going to be happy with it.” » Uh, Mike, do you have thoughts on that

57:39 on the different manufacturers? » Here’s where it boils down to. Um, when I spoke to Rob from Garland, they’ve done I’ve got I’ve got a list and I think so does RDA of all the schools that they’ve done. So, we they’ve already overcome this huddle, you know, in terms of getting the products that we want. So, uh, I I think we should be all set. Um, you know, we’re I’m going to reach out to Garland and I’m sure RDA will and together we can come up with language that meets the uh the bidding laws of Massachusetts and still gets us what we want, which is a superior product.

58:23 Okay, Okay, any final thoughts?

58:30 If something comes up, email me or the group. Um, I’m happy to pass any messages along. Just I’m just going to do a quick roll call to adjourn the meeting. Um, please just say uh in favor or yes or whatever, but uh make a motion to adjourn. Um, Mark » in favor. like Kareema.

58:59 » Oh, sorry. I was muted. In favor, sorry. » I’m sorry. Yeah. Um Mike » Pifferling. » Uh in favor. » Brian Sarafin. » In favor. » Ralph. » Yes. » And me as well. So, um motion to adjourn at 12:59. Thank you everyone. » Thanks. » Thank you. » Thank you everybody. Take care. Bye.